Our Show

SB, I always put mine on in the morning and wear them all day.. And, carry a tube of lipstick in my pocket.

And TJ, that colt is a spitting imagine of the one I lost (Chad). I couldn't believe when I saw that shot. I just wish I had taken some shots of him before he got sick again and died. However, those up right front legs do not look good and that is exactly why I didn't do it.. Plus, I would not be able to look at them now. I just cannot do it, it's too sad.

Merikle, no one is going to put you down for not using a lip chain. And, yes you can control a horse with it. You can take them right to their knees if they want to test it. But, if you do not use one and something happens you need to be prepared to take responsibilty for not taking the measure to prevent that. Not every stallion needs to wear one. But, you can talk to anyone who has ever shown stallions or even handled one and they will tell you to use it when you are out around other horses and people so that nothing happens to anyone. You can learn to use it and likely will wonder why you never did it before. It does not hurt the horse..

7C, I remember when my girl friend tought me how to use it on my yearling colt. I thought I had died and gone to heaven. He was so calm and never tried to run off with me again. Needless to so I was much calmer too and wouldn't do it any other way..

Bluejay wrote:

Merikle, no one is going to put you down for not using a lip chain. And, yes you can control a horse with it. You can take them right to their knees if they want to test it. But, if you do not use one and something happens you need to be prepared to take responsibilty for not taking the measure to prevent that. Not every stallion needs to wear one. But, you can talk to anyone who has ever shown stallions or even handled one and they will tell you to use it when you are out around other horses and people so that nothing happens to anyone. You can learn to use it and likely will wonder why you never did it before. It does not hurt the horse..

Well I think the main thing would be I dont trust myself with one , I have no issues with it being used though. I just worry he'll be a turd and I'd yank and really injure him or something... I know I did use it once when he was being a booger about having his legs clipped, and even from just keeping contact on his gums it left such an indent I just don't want to imagine what could happen if he got a good hard yank because im not thinking or something.

However, reading that Denny Hasset book 7Cedars recommended (and it was so worth the purchase price!) it does say the lip chain not only allows extra control, but even a wiggle can make them stay more still and pay attention.

I think though at our last show this year, if he's a turd (He's had a while off because of his injury) I will slip the lip chain under that lip of his. LOL like 7Cedars "Kid", He knows I wont *really* get him in trouble in the ring.

You guys, I need to explain something about this chain OVER the nose.

There's standards for the chain. Under the chin, showing; lip chain, control, especially on stallions or when the horse is being a freaking idiot; over the nose IS USED WITH A STALLION WHEN THEY BREED!!!!!

That is, IF and only IF you handle him like that...and he's okay. If not, out comes the lip chain.

To have a chain over the nose, and I'm talking in the states here, it's very unprofessional. The reason it's used over the nose with a stallion is to differentiate, let the stallion know, yo, dude, you're going to breed a mare. He'll know, trust me.

Just like, Rick was worried that Kid would think every time he gets the lip chain put on him, he was going to breed... well, horses are smarter than average bears, they know if they're at a show, that's it all business, and if they're at home, and can smell the mares, then it's a whole other ballgame.

You don't have to jerk the lip chain, half the time, it's there, and it does the job all by itself; however, when you've got a 1,400 pound stud that's around 3-4 years old, that's being a total ARSE, I'm fixing to jerk some freaking sense into that head of his! And I'd never EVER used a lip chain before that day. And the only reason I jerked it, was to let him know I was sick of his crap, no more, and if he wanted to fight, by GAWD, I was leveling the playing field! And he didn't freak, he leaned back a bit, didn't back up, but he knew mom had had enough, and this was business, to quit jacking around.

Now, with my paint stud, I could breed him with a gosh-danged hay rope - not with Kid. I NEVER EVER put a lip chain or the chain over his nose - never. Never had to. It depends on the horse. If the sucker's trying to eat you, well.....

And another bad thing about putting the chain over the nose... I've seen a ton of horses that literally had an indent where that chain goes, and I don't like that - that irks me! I've seen a ton of T-breds, geldings mostly that have that, and that's just not necessary.

Sheila, I looked at some pics of me showing Pep. I was wrong, I had the chain under his chin. I also think it looks funky over the nose. Can't imagine why I thought I put it over his nose. Although we do put it over his nose to breed.
I have no idea what the guy who had Pep did to him, but if he's at home, he believes any mare wearing a halter & lead is meant to breed. I can ride one past his pen and nothing, but lead one and whoa boy, the screaming starts. He's got quite a few zaps these past few days while I've been prepping sale horses.

Me, Threw the mouth for breeding
Over the gums for showing
Over the nose at home for them just being rotten!
HALTER STALLIONS....
The are pump up on the best feed, the best hay, Not given turn out time, all the time, Due to hair coats, Keeping them just on the edge. etc. As a trainer that won the world once told me. You work them enough to keep them eating but not enough no lose your edge.
Its all on how you train them for what jobs are expected of them. I would NOT show a stallion with out them over the gums, period. It only takes one time, of them seeing something, smelling something, to get their attention going another way.

I think it really is a preferance. Personally, my stallion is bred with a halter and lunge line (extra rope there just in case, but have never had to use it). He teases the mare over our teasing wall, has his do-dad washed, and then he is walked to be presented to the mare. He isn't even nickering at this point. Staring intensively, but thats it.

He then is presented to the mare, and waits for his cue to breed. I say up, and up he goes. He is finished, we walk back, wash up. And he goes back to eating his food.


My stud colt has always been handled with a chain over his nose. He is very studdy, however, I can take him through a herd of mares without him taking a step out of line. He knows if he's even thinking about feeling stupid, I CAN feel it through the chain and he's fixing to get himself in big trouble. So he just doesnt. He is just learning its NOT ok to talk to the girls.

If he can handle breeding and showing together, then fine. However I do plan that if this colt is still a stud he will be shown for many years. So showing comes first. However he's only a halter horse until he can be broke... So then at that point he is a western pleasure horse... But when it comes down to breeding, the differentiating factor for him would be a seperate halter that certainly feels different. We use that with his sire, and he definetly knows the difference.

I don't have to be hard on the chain over the nose, I can even do the slightest wiggle and he knows to stand still or else. He has no marks on his nose, and respects both the chain and I. He also knows if need be, I am not afraid to be mean to him. idk, we have never had any issues.

But I do see your point I just plan to continue showing him with my preferance first, and only go to a harsher lip chain if the situation calls for it.

I don't think anyone uses a lip chain for breeding.. I certainly don't. And, I can walk my stud by mares with not a sound.

But, when he goes out in public he wears one. I think you missunderstood the part about taking them out in public and never getting in a situation to harm someone else.. That is totally up to you if you choose not to. It will also be totally up to you if something happens..

TJ, we do not use the chain in the mouth at breeding. He does wear the shank different at that time. Course my guy is pretty lazy about the whole thing..

Bluejay wrote:

I don't think anyone uses a lip chain for breeding.. I certainly don't. And, I can walk my stud by mares with not a sound.

But, when he goes out in public he wears one. I think you missunderstood the part about taking them out in public and never getting in a situation to harm someone else.. That is totally up to you if you choose not to. It will also be totally up to you if something happens..

I do understand the going out in public view... but I am cautious, watch my space and Tristan knows he is to be an complete gentleman at all times, and since he is only a yearling he does nicker on occaision to other horses, but thats as far as it goes. No pulling, no pushing, nothing.

I just meant that I do think it is a preferance, and like anything with horses its all in opinion, and the difference there of. I have no problems in people using lip chains, whether at a show or at home. Not my horse I just don't feel at this point Tristan and I need one altogether (doesnt mean that it couldn't change, but I sure hope it doesnt).

It is so amazing to see how within the same breed horses can be so different I know halter horses are fed and trained and bred differently and I sure wouldn't want to be around many that I have seen w/o a chain esp. just because of their massive size so intimidating... and there there is my little stud who has never had a chain on in his life and is such a gentleman has been hauled all over the countryside with mares in fact his first trainer swore we wouldn't be able to get him to breed a mare he was so quiet used to stable and haul him next to the mares because he was so quiet must have thought he was ????? I know my gelding I rode 3day eventing with I always kept a chain on because he was so fresh all the time from so much conditioning he was harder to handle than my half pint stud.

Yo, Bluejay, are you joking me.... HA!

Tell ya a story. Before I started handling Kid for breeding, I watched him, and truthfully, I was just a bit intimidated! I'd seen his half brother breed my paint mare, and that was sucker was just raunchy, raunchy, raunchy...

Anyhoos, after collecting that one year, and getting the gosh-danged bill, the next year, I procrastinated, I was a little bit afraid. I'd got him finally right in the show pen, but the breeding - that was different. Rick says, whatcha going to do... I told him, I had to be in the right frame of mind to do this... so finally, got myself together, USED THE LIP CHAIN, and always did! No way I was going to do it without it... and as we were going through the alley, he started bowing up, and we had a real quick discussion. He learned, he couldn't say a peep until I said okay, when I first saw the mare. Then he'd strut, sidepass, idiot... I came close to pulling him over one time when he jumped on a mare before he was ready; after that, he got a lot better. No way in the world would I have bred that stud without a lip chain!!!!

Like Lynn said, the difference between stallions are unreal. I've seen Quarter running and T-bred studs that are about the most gosh-danged vicious suckers I've ever seen. Reminic is a total a-hole. My paint stud, as I said, I bred him only with his halter and a regular lead rope on... go figure!

One thing you need to understand about stallions, they're all different. We've all heard stories of stallions turning on their owners for no apparent reason... DO NOT EVER let one of those suckers get out of the corner of your eye!

And those people who decide to do it wrong, because they think they know everything, who put not only their horses and themselves in jeopardy, but other people as well, well then, I sure hope they've got a BIG CHECKBOOK!

Even with Scamp, as much as I handled him when he was a weanling, before we cut him, he started getting just a bit too big for his breeches. As weanlings and yearlings, they don't seem to be so bad, but when you get something that weighs 1,200 pounds plus - do people really think they're going to win that fight? HA!

it truly is amazing the difference the attitude in studs I swear I won't own another that isnt just like Peppy we bought him as a 3yr old colt he had been started under saddle and was such a gentleman never has ever put tension on the end of a lead rope but had been started as a rope horse which I think is probably the difference they just don't mess around with ropes. Our yearling is also such a gentle soul I hope he stays that way got the clippers out loaded him in the trailer and trimmed his feet this past weekend and all was wonderful never had clippers or a ride in the trailer and he jumped right in. I tell you that colt just amazes me day after day.

lol yup, everyone has their own horse to deal with. But when it does come down to things, you do know your own horse best.

And Lynn its funny that you say that. Showing welsh/caspian stallions this year, I am amazed how about 99% of the stallions even there were completely fresh... you know the type that takes every bit of your time to either pay attention to, or correct.

Funny thing is these little sun of a guns show with an inhand bridle, which is a freakin straight bar! The bit has a chain on each side and your lead hooks onto that. You notice the people who opted for a rubber bit, are now fighting relentlessly with their rank 2 yr old welsh pony stud, and then are shocked when he bites the bit in half!

Its crazy how the warmbloods and sport ponies go... some, you never knew they were studs... and others, you know they are a stud the minute they step off the dang trailer.

I do like the way my boys handle, would I take the big guy to a show at this point? Nope! He's spent way to long breeding and eating, So we plan to chute jump him this fall, and finish him under saddle And thats it!

However Tristan, the mild mannered guy he is, he is actually best behaved at the show grounds while in the ring, surrounded by other horses. But I don't doubt in the slightest that if something did happen that I could get him under control. But while this guy is studdy he is scared and I am his security blanket. We've also worked everyday together since he was about 3 months old. I do trust him, however I do pay attention.

The big guy? do I trust him... Hell no! I guess it just depends on the stallion, and the handler.

They are all different horses. Thank goodness.. Tommy just about has to be pushed up on the phantom for colletion when he is breeding he is so dosile. He is very much like a gelding. Very well mannered.

When I take him out I do not control what other people do. And, if you have been out there you should know there are some really stupid ones out there.

I have had some smaller studs that I did not worry about. But, when you are leading one that is 1400 or 1500lbs if they ever figured out they could take you down the road, you would not have a chance... And, even a smaller horse has way more power then a humane will ever have. I do let him puff up and strut.. But, there will be no talking PERIOD.. In fact, I like it when he puffs up and struts his stuff. Long as he keeps his mouth shut.. he is very proud of himself..

I'm glad its you guys at the end of them chains and not me.

By the way Bluejay, Sweet Dixie took two more purples home last weekend. That should knock her back up to #1.

Bluejay wrote:

TJ, we do not use the chain in the mouth at breeding. He does wear the shank different at that time. Course my guy is pretty lazy about the whole thing..

Tucker I had to his first year after that it was like PLEASE lets get this done, I like to eat supper sometime.

BUT I have had some rank, Rank, RANK stallions I have had to do this to, Ones I did not raise or start them on breeding. You know the kind that would put a mare into the wall. Boy did they get some lessons!

Im just glad Im out of the stallion business.... So is Kirt.
Im not saying we would NEVER do it again, but until the market changes, we are even going to think about it.

Mare, I have not heard from Leann since she told me she was for sale.. Normally I get an email from her about her show.. I will have to email her and see what's up..

I try to avoid personalitlies that move like a roller coaster going up and down and round and round all the time. Or, get caught up with other strange people who are just plain nuts like Paula and Theresa. I think friends should help each other not put each other down.