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 Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT

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Cindy

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Registration date : 2007-02-07

PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 24th 2007, 10:49 pm

Is there a vet school in your area? We have Texas A&M here and California has UC Davis. I could swear there was a good one in Oregon. If possible, will they take his case? Just a thought. pray

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Ragdoll



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Age : 66
Location : Nevada
Registration date : 2007-04-02

PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 24th 2007, 11:25 pm

It sounds more and more like blunt-force trauma. I bet another horse ran into him going at a pretty good clip. His kidneys could bruised as well as a pelvic fracture. Is there a chance you can get him to Boise State?
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Lynn M.

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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 25th 2007, 1:31 am

that swellling could be the result of a pelvic fx... acute kidney failure comes with any really serious illness/injury as long as he is eating and drinking and peeing that should work it's self out and won't be long term... has the vet checked his BUN and Creatine levels... if those are normal or close too don't sweat the kidney stuff at this point ok... you said the labs where pretty normal these can be slightly off and still be ok so don't get too worried right away about that... do you have a good complete feed you could give him... when we have anyone that isn't feeling good we go straight to Buckeyes senior feed and really pump that into them young or old it has all the fiber etc.. so you don't have to worry about hay etc...
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Lynn M.

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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 25th 2007, 12:34 pm

ok was talking with Hubby and he said w/o an MRI one way to diagnosis a pelvic fx (which is actually pretty common in horses) is to get the colt standing on a very flat surface ie:concrete is best... all four feet have to be square stand behind them and from the back look for the high 2 hip points they should be perfectly level in a horse w/o a fx... in a horse as with in a human there is quite a bit of bleeding at the time of injury which would explain the swelling- in men we see lots of swelling in the neither regions with lots of discoloration Hubby said the horses he has seen have quite a bit of swelling too..
edited to add: he also said this is easy to do if he flipped over just right, got pinned in the stall, got his leg caught under a panel, slipped and got his legs splayed, etc... if he quits eating he suggested Manna Pros Round Up- it can be made into a mush and be tube fed if necessary we did that with my mare when she broke her jaw and quit eating it is wonderful for that... it has an alfalfa base- keep us posted!!!
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Bluejay

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Location : Oregon
Registration date : 2007-02-07

PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 25th 2007, 10:27 pm

This morning he looked better.. The sunken part around the tail head was normal, the swelling in front of his sheath was gone and the swelling at the end of his sheath was gone. He was able to get up and besides being sluggish had normal behavior.. scratch

Seems he goes down hill during the day. We do have the OSU vet school. We are not going to run up a big vet bill on him because we cannot afford it. That is what would happen here. Been there done that. You spend thousands of dollars to find out they do not know what is wrong or you have to put them down anyway.. The vets I am dealing with have been around the block for many years.. This has baffled them. scratch

He has had the blood work done twice on him and other then the CK still high everything else is normal.. BUN and Creatinine are in normal range. His hips are even. There is nothing for him to get caught under. We keep our place free of that..

He could have taken a hard hit. He does not have any place on his body that is tender. He eats, drinks and pees yellow.. The Buskeye products are not avai around here. We did get him some Nutena safe choice and he does like that. He loves his alfalfa.. So, is eating better. Poop is normal.

The vet did say he could have burned himself when he was peeing laying down.. I washed him good with Ivory soap and we will see what his sheath looks like tomorrow. The girls did get a hold of his little colt part today and said they cleaned a lot off of it that had a really bad smell. Could not be described.. Only that it was really bad and not normal.. So, I am hoping that part of his problem will be OK tomorrow. He is able to get up and down now.. Goes about it the wrong way. But, I will take it.. This is the worst roller coaster ride I have ever been on.. Crying or Very sad Crying or Very sad

He is much like a kid who doesn't feel good. But, today Colleen said he even argued with her a bit. What a gal.. She spends much of her time watching him and taking care of him. I have to go to work during the day and she is with him most the day.. If she could bundle him up and take him into her house she would.. WHAT A GAL. I do not know what I would do without her.. cheering cheering pray

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Lynn M.

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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 25th 2007, 10:46 pm

well at least the little guy is a fighter that is for sure!!! doesn't seem the type to just give it up... that is great maybe this is going to be that EPSM thingy after all and that seemed pretty manageable... with a lot of TLC and that sounds like something you definately aren't going to run out of any time soon!!!!! Give him a kiss from KS!
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Ragdoll



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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 25th 2007, 11:58 pm

When my colt broke his pelvis.....He laid down quite a bit....He'd get up like a cow....Rear-end first.
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Bluejay

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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 27th 2007, 11:04 am

The vet said it would take two weeks after the original tie up for that muscles to clean themselves and get back to normal.. We are at 11 days now. He was up and nickered when I went in the barn this morning.. coffee

His sheath is still swollen and cool to the touch.. Not the whole sheath, just the end of it. Lump is gone and the fet locks are still swollen.. I am going to put him on some different bedding today and see if that changes anything.. He was bedded on this stuff before all this happened.. But, I think I should rule out alergy to the bedding.. He is on fir swadust now and I will put him on some pine chips.. He still will not eat the fancy feed we got for him so I am going to offer him oats this morning.. Basketball

Too many changes for the little guy when this all started.. Taken from his mother, loaded in the trailer and hauled to a strange place and different feed.. That was just the first day.. Then brought home and in to a new stall, different feed. scratch

I am now going to focus on the process of elimination and get some more blood work on him and see where that is all at. I suspect it is normal.. study

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Lynn M.

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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 27th 2007, 8:24 pm

check out this site we have been feeding beet pulp recently and I love it and what it has done for my mares and colts!!! I particularly like the Calcium levels since we can't really feed alfalfa around here in KS... I wasn't aware of how good it was for the Insulin resistant/ glucose intolarent horses and those who get hot on sweet feeds here is some interesting receipes for horses kind of a neat link

http://www.myfineequine.com/cush.htm
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Cindy

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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 27th 2007, 10:50 pm

Lynn M. wrote:
check out this site we have been feeding beet pulp recently and I love it and what it has done for my mares and colts!!! I particularly like the Calcium levels since we can't really feed alfalfa around here in KS... I wasn't aware of how good it was for the Insulin resistant/ glucose intolarent horses and those who get hot on sweet feeds here is some interesting receipes for horses kind of a neat link

http://www.myfineequine.com/cush.htm

Beet pulp does wonders for TB's too!

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Bluejay

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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 27th 2007, 11:08 pm

He will not eat the beet pulp. I decided today to give him what he is used to eating since he is getting so thin. He gobbled up the oats.. This is what he is used to eating. I think with everything that happened all at once with him trying to get him to eat other feed is just adding to the problem. Once I get him back on track I can slowing change him over..

I stripped his stall and replace the bedding in case there is something in in that is doing this. He was much brighter today. I will see how this goes over the next few days and get some new labs on him Tues..

His back bone is sticking up and he is getting thinner by the day.. This will also cause him to be weak.. So, he will get what he will eat for now.. Also, he has not laid down today. We are at 11 days post tie up.. The vets said it would take two weeks for his muscles to get rid of all the toxin that went in when he tied up..

You have all been so supportive. This has been really rough.. I never know when we are going to walk out there and find him dead.. I have been so stressed over this.. I hope we are on the right track and he recovers.. And, I think we will all learn something from this.

This morning there was no lump, sheath and fet locks are still swollen.. He is eating good today..

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Lynn M.

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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 27th 2007, 11:11 pm

I have one mare I bought in the fall in foal.... that no matter what I do cant make her look decent she has been power packed- gets a fat supplement etc.... I have tried everything I swear but since I started feeding the beet pulp she has finally started to put weight over her back and ribs yeah!!!!
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Bluejay

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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 28th 2007, 10:32 pm

Chad had another good day today. He is getting up and down. Eating his oats and even has some life. Not much, but not like he is dying. he was resting when I got home and got up to eat. He is resting again..

I sure wish I knew why his sheath is swollen scratch I can understand why his fet locks are with no activity.. Any horse would puff up there. His pee was yellow and that was a good sign.

Will have to see how he is tomorrow.. Hopefully he will keep improving. pray My gut keeps saying give him a round of SMZ's. Even though there is no temp and not likely an infection.. Hard to hold back and not do so much and let some time go by to see how he does. We are 12 days post tie up. His pee is still yellow and that is a good sign.. I think if his sheath is swllen he has and infection there.. Just not one to give him a temp scratch

Opinions please coffee

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Lynn M.

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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 28th 2007, 11:07 pm

don't do the antibiotics... hold off... his little body doesn't need the added insult of that esp the kidneys right now if there is any concern about them... I know there is that knee jerk reaction to give them but I promise you that is not the way to go- get the labs back from Tues and if his WBC's are elevated then talk with the vet about maybe something like that but for now I personally wouldn't do it... you may send him into a tale spin and right now he is going forward... even if they are baby steps they are forward...
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Bluejay

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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 29th 2007, 10:27 am

OK, no anitbiotics.. I know I am so eager to get through this I have done too much already with the feed thing and all. The feed is no good to him when he will not eat it. I have $100.00 worth of fancy food here he will not touch.. I will add the beet pulp once he gets out of danger. I feed that anyway.. study coffee

My stallion only gets a few pounds of grain a day and is on orchard grass. He was loosing too much weight for my taste so I put him on the beet pulp. He looks better then he ever has now.. Keeps the right amount of weight on him and he is not fat anymore.. Dancing

He is up and eating this morning.. I have not been out yet to see what the other things are doing yet.. I will get out there shortly. I did get to see him get up last night and he had much more spring in his get up.. Still not perfect but a long way from not getting up at all. In fact, he is getting up and down with out another horse there to encourage him. So, for now we are having a good day so far.. cheering

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Triple J Quarter Horses

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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 29th 2007, 1:56 pm

Bless his heart, Hes a fighter! You keep fighting little man.

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Lynn M.

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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 29th 2007, 3:33 pm

Bluejay you need to post some pics of your big beautiful guy when you get the time I for one would love to see how he is doing!
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Bluejay

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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 29th 2007, 11:16 pm

I will try to get some of him. I just heard from my girls that work for me that they found an article on this and the swollen sheath is part of it.. study

I had the blood work done today and will have results tomorrow.. I will let you all know how it looks.. I am still waiting for the article on the swelling from them. He is up and down today and seems to still be improving. The vet seemed a bit shocked that he would not get up for him even when he took the blood.. Well, he had no reason to get up and just did not feel like it. I have gotten used to it. coffee

The girls put him out in the arena this morning and when I went out he walked away from me.. lol! He let me know there was no way he was coming out of there.. lol! He can't run from me so I could have caught him.. cheers At least he felt resistant.. Dancing

Still no where near, not even close to being normal. I will take what he gave me today.. doggie kitty

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Bluejay

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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 30th 2007, 11:07 pm

Got Chad's labs back today.. We are on the way I think. bounce

He is able to get up and down now. Eats good and still does not have much energy.. These are the most improtant numbers.. There were some articles found on the internet regarding the swollen sheath being a part of this and utters if it was female. A firend of mine also mentioned that males can get a swollen sheath from no exersize.. HUM, that eases my mind.. coffee


The 18th

CDK ( muscle enzyme normal is 20-500) 622,560
BUN (normal 10-25) 53
creatinine (kidney function normal 1.2-2.0) 2.9


Yesterday:

CDK ( muscle enzyme normal is 20-500) 6412 WA HOOOOOOOO
BUN (normal 10-25) 33
creatinine (kidney function normal 1.2-2.0) 1.2 YIP YIP YIP. This is really the biggy. You can work with the other stuff.. But, when organs start to fail you are in big trouble..

He gets up and down and eats good. He is still not a normal colt. I think he will make it. Unless this all starts over again.. I can deal with him being thin.. I can fix even the worst looking horse through nutrition.. I have a good feeling about this.. doggie

I am so thankful for everyone who has helped me through this.. I hope we all learned something. I know I sure have.. I will post some shots of Chad taken the night before he tied up. All, I have to tell you about how he looks now is he has a swollen sheath and he is thin.. His back bone only sticks up a bit and he is not buff.. He will not make the weanling futurity as I will do nothing to comprimise him... No

As Cindy says, if the Lord brings you to it he will take you through it. I love that saying and believe it totally.. All things happen for a reason.. OK enough of that.. I get it.. My horses are my children. And, I have a gut feeling this one will be the best ever..
cheering pray yeah

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Ragdoll



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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 30th 2007, 11:13 pm

YYYYYYYYYYEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Bluejay

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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 30th 2007, 11:20 pm

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The night before the first tie up.. He is much thinner now.. Still furry. I am starting the every two week cycle on worming. I would say he has lost at lest 75 lbs through all this... Sad

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Bluejay

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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   May 30th 2007, 11:21 pm

This does feel good.. He will come back. He was a nice colt to begin with.. cheers2 cheers2

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Mare

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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   June 15th 2007, 6:39 pm

Bluejay how is Chad doing now? I think he's got the best nurse taking care of him. My friends horse's sheath swelled up and the vet over the phone told her to clean his feet good and lunge him. He had a rock in his foot and wasnt exercising like normal. He wasnt limping at all so we were stumped. But it was gone by the next day. So that must be a common thing. Keep us posted on that little guy.
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shazgeoff

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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   June 17th 2007, 7:01 am

i know this is probably a long shot but could it be Lymes Disease.My horse had this and showed symptoms that arnt in the book so it took ages to diagnose this.

He was acting if drunk and was very stiff,hated being moved.Its always worth the test to rule it out.
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Bluejay

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PostSubject: Re: Need your thoughts on this one.. IMPORTANT   June 21st 2007, 11:17 am

UPDATE: Chad has more energy now. He is playing with the filly I just weaned. He really looks like CRAP though.. Eats like an adult horse. He is eating the beet pulp now. So will be working on the new diet for him.

He has no muscle at all. Rib showing, pop belly and very thin looking. I am going to hit him again with wormer. I did that when I got home and will do it again. I have read some articles that say it can take up to four months for his muscle to come back.. I have not taken any shots of him yet. I haven't decided if i want to do that or not. confused

The little hernia that he had went away and now it is back.. All in all he is coming along.. Just hard to see what was a nice buffed up colt look like this. Personally I think he was allergic to the grass and this is why this happened. That is the only thing that makes sense. He was fine until he got out on pasture.. study

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